I had the chance to talk with my friend Steph about her experience as a gestational carrier and what an inspiring and enlightening conversation it was. Steph is the epitome of the right person to be a gestational carrier — imperturbable, positive and endlessly giving. You’ll love listening to her talk about her experience. We recorded the interview live as well which is posted at the end of this so you can watch it or read it!

Can you tell people a little bit about yourself?

My name is Steph and I live in Utah with my husband and my two-and-a-half-year-old son, Sonny. This will be my 18th year, this fall, living in Utah. I’m from Ohio and I fell in love with the mountains and never left. I found a place here, found my friends, my home, my family, and we just love it.

To start this conversation, can you tell me the difference between using the term gestational carrier versus surrogacy?

That’s a great question, because I learned it as I went as well. The difference is, if you surrogate, you’re actually donating your own egg so that is tied to your DNA. And if you are a gestational carrier, it is completely the parents’ egg and sperm or if they were using a donor, the embryo is already created and I am just housing the baby. So, I am a true gestational carrier because it was not my egg, I didn’t donate an egg, it was 100% their baby.

So that’s a big difference. And thank you for clarifying that because I don’t think a lot of people recognize that difference there.

No, they don’t. And then they also sometimes just assume that if you’re being a surrogate, that you are donating your egg, which is in fact not the case. Science is super neat and you can do all these crazy cool things now. So for this family, it was 100% their embryo and I carried it.

So tell me, how did this start? How did you decide to do this?

Well, I guess when I was around 20 or 21, I was a nanny for a family while I was going to college. They had one daughter and she could not have any more children. And she was like, “You’re so great. You love kids, you should totally be a surrogate.” And I did kind of think about it at the time but they were quite a bit older and I was quite a bit younger and you know, I hadn’t lived my life yet. And so it never really came to be a serious conversation but it was in the back of my mind. And back then I thought I’d love to do that for somebody but I think I needed to live my life and have children of my own first before that commitment. I’m an only child. I didn’t really like that. I always dreamed of the big family, the big chaotic gatherings. And so then fast forward to having lived my life and I had a lot of fun and made a lot of memories and we finally decided to have a family of our own. When I was 34, I gave birth to Sonny.

How this journey began was my two very close friends, Emily and Laura were like, “Hey, you know, do you know anyone who would want to be a gestational carrier for our sister because she isn’t able to have children.” And it was a really trying time in the pandemic to find carriers. This couple actually has one daughter via surrogate who is now three and they used an agency but due to COVID and her timeline there just wasn’t a lot of people going in-person to fill these roles. And so they were really struggling and their only option was a woman in Seattle or California who would’ve done it. And I think they would have went that route but it would’ve been a different journey to not really be able to be part of the experience and be at any of the appointments. And so they said, “Do you know of anyone in your circle?” And I just said that maybe I would do it, you know? And they were like you’d be so great, you loved being pregnant, which I did. I know it’s not for everyone.

I thought about it more over the holidays, and I said, you know what, I really would like to meet with your sister and her husband and chat a little bit more about this in seriousness because I’m kind of interested. And, I do actually know this family. They’re not in my complete inner circle but I know who they are and I’ve met them. So we went to dinner and chatted all of the details and I came home and talked about it with Nick and I was like, I really want to do this. And I’m pretty sure we will have more kids, but it wasn’t in the cards in that phase in life when this conversation started. I had one year old, I wasn’t ready to have another child myself for various reasons. And I thought, why do I have to wait? You know, like there’s kind of a risk, no matter when you get pregnant, you know, like your same risks that yes something could go wrong or whatever. And I think in my heart, I just knew that like, what was meant to be would be, and if something did go wrong — thankfully it didn’t then — but you know, I’m blessed with one happy little guy and that would be fine.

So, I was like, let’s do it. And that was kind of where it came to be. I loved being pregnant and it was such a cool experience. I was so sad to see it end not knowing when and if I would do it again. Like I said, I think we will have more kids, but you know, when you have one, your mind is not really there yet. And so I didn’t want to pass up this opportunity. And it was kind of cool that it’s a family member of my really good friends and it was helping them grow their family. And so I was like, let’s do it. Where do we start?

That is awesome. So where do you start? I mean in your situation you knew the family so you had that connection. But, you’ve decided you’re going to go for it. Where do you go from there?

For this time around, I think in this situation, it was helpful that they had done it one time before. They knew the perspective of meeting a complete stranger through an agency where everything is lined out X, Y, and Z, and very self explanatory, which I will touch on that, that they had a very positive experience as well. They loved their carrier. She was a mom of three and then she signed up to do this. And I don’t think that the labor and delivery went quite as planned and just due to some other health stuff she was unable to do it again, but that was also reassuring for me to hear because they loved this woman so much and she loved doing it that had she not, you know, age, weight, other factors and ended in the C-section, she would’ve done it again for them. And I thought, super cool. But, for us, you start by going to a fertility center and there are coordinators there that help you every step of the way. Usually if you are looking to be a gestational carrier, they already had started this journey several years ago by harvesting her eggs and his sperm samples and then creating these embryos. And unfortunately, you know, you start with so many embryos and then it dwindles down and they rate them for quality or if they will actually take. And then you’re only left with a certain amount and those are frozen. So they were paying to store these eggs at that fertility center. So they already had a relationship there. So for most people you’d probably start by reaching out to a fertility center and speaking with a coordinator about that aspect, but they will help you, if you need a donor on either side, whether that’s an egg donor or a sperm donor, they can guide you every way of how to do those things.

So we kind of started there. Along with some legal stuff, even though I wasn’t worried in the slightest about anything in that aspect but there has to be a legal writeup, no matter what. But, before you even get there, I went to the fertility center and I had basically like a physical and a complete exam to make sure that I check out in all of these categories to be a carrier. Then I had a procedure done, which was kind of like one of these things where it’s an added bonus when you’re doing this for somebody. I didn’t have anything wrong but there were little, almost leftover follicle type things like from me that if I were to just get pregnant again they may not affect me at all. You can just live with them but they just want like a complete clean slate when you’re carrying someone else’s child. So I was under general anesthesia and it was a super quick procedure. And I checked off all of these boxes and then moved into the second step which is doing some legal stuff and coming to an agreement on various things with the people that you’re doing it for. Things set up that, you know, God forbid I died in birth, my son and Nick were going to have something there or, you know, these situations like an emergency hysterectomy. So we had to through all of that and then sign an agreement there.

Then there’s a psychological examination for myself and my husband. That was pretty lengthy. It was like a four hour zoom thing. Not quite prepared for that! And it all went really well and the woman was super nice, but you know, you just feel like you’re, I don’t know, like you’re interviewing for something super important, like after we were like – “Did we fail?!” “What if they’re going to say we can’t do it?” But it was also really insightful to speak to this psychologist because she also asks the questions that are important. And, you know, when I was just like, let’s do it, you know, she was like, well, what are you going to do when this baby comes? Are you going to hold the kid? You know? And I’m like, “Oh, I don’t know, sure? If they want me to?” But she was like, “Oh, no, we don’t recommend that.” And I’m like, “OK!” So it was almost like you’re being quizzed for something that you couldn’t prepare for, but really, I learned a lot along the way by going through that.

So how long did all of that take before they tried to implant the embryo? And I guess I should ask, did it take right away the first time?

Fortunately it did. That was another thing in the contract. They said it was completely up to me. It’s not just go back in the next week. I basically have to go through all of these hormone shots, like go through my cycle, all of these things again. So it is like tolling, not just for them, if it would’ve failed, but for me, and it sounded like — just from speaking with the director at the fertility center — most people agree to three times because it usually doesn’t take on the first time. So that’s what I agreed to. And, fortunately it took on the first try.

That’s amazing. So how long would that take then? Let’s say it fails the first time? What’s that whole cycle like?

Well, I don’t know for sure but it can be another one to three months because they have a system for everything. Like I had a calendar of injecting myself. I learned a lot in doing that, about what it might be like for women who struggle to get pregnant. I can’t fully understand that because I didn’t go through it, so I don’t want to speak for them, but I did get a taste of that. That was probably the least fun part of all of it. You’re taking medication at this certain time. You’re injecting yourself with all these things because you’re starting to trick your body to be ready for pregnancy. But for us it was sped up a little bit because she had done it before and she knew the people. And so all of this started by talking in December/January and then the implantation was the end of April. It was three months of meds, shots and doctor appointments before we could get started. And the director did tell me that was on the faster side of things. That really if you go in and you want to start this journey from clean slate expect a year for everything. But if you already have your embryos then it’s usually about six months for all of this.

And then the baby was born the following January. Is that right?

He was born this January. So I came up a couple days ago on three months postpartum.

Amazing. I’m looking forward to asking you about postpartum as well, but I want to get back to when you’re talking with the psychologist. It’s interesting. When Zach told me that you were acting as a gestational carrier, I thought, “Oh, Steph is the perfect person for it.” You just have this personality that is very giving but I also think you have a real positive outlook on the world. And I think that that’s probably very necessary when you’re doing something so giving for someone else. There is a lot of emotion involved in this. When you were talking to the psychologist, what are some other things that came up that they wanted you to think about as you’re going through this journey? And, what came about for you carrying this child but knowing that you then wouldn’t parent the child?

She asked a lot of questions. At the beginning it was more about each of us. My home life, my upbringing, what do I do. Same thing for Nick. The other questions that were more for me were like, “Are you going to tell your son?”, “How are you going to tell your son about this journey?” And, I hadn’t given a lot of thought to it initially because he was so young. For me, I was like, well, it’s not a secret at all. And it’s definitely something when he’s old enough to understand that I would love to share with him because it’s so cool. And I don’t think enough people even really know about it or what it is to really fully understand it, you know? But in our situation, I didn’t really talk about it a lot with him. And that was just because I felt like it was really confusing in a normal setting. If I was pregnant and having another baby, I’d be like oh, there’s a baby and we’d be talking about this baby. And then as he aged, it’s like I come home and my belly’s smaller and there’s no baby. And I think that would be really confusing for him. So I openly talked about it with our friends and everyone else but I didn’t really share so much of that with my one and a half year old. I think it was easier that way. But kids have the intuition because without even talking about it, as I got super huge, he’d be poking it and sometimes he would say, “Baby, baby.” We just weren’t like, “Mama’s having a baby, a baby’s coming home.” So I just explained that to the therapist that down the road, for sure. I took pictures, I want to remember this journey but there’ll be a time and a place. Now maybe with a four-year-old or something, it would’ve been a different thing. I would’ve shared it.

So how was this pregnancy compared to Sonny’s pregnancy?

They were very similar. I was fortunate to have what I felt like was an easy pregnancy and I shouldn’t use the term easy because it’s a lot of work, but you know I worked up until my due date with Sonny and he was four or six days late. And you know, I just lived life and basically tried to do as much as I could. And this time around it was the same. I worked up to 39 weeks with this guy and still took some trips. The only aspect that was harder was that I had a toddler this time. And so a little more tired and that was due to chasing someone else around but I loved the journey. I loved all of it.

And, it was almost a better labor, because I knew what to expect. No one could have prepared me, not hypno birthing, not anything that I did the first time around could have prepared me for that labor. And so at least this time not only did it go quicker, I understood my body more. I understood more what was coming versus the first time around. I just thought I was in dying pain and it never stopped.

Yeah, definitely. You have a reference point, right? So for those who don’t know, you were in a car accident right before you gave birth. I’m so happy that you’re okay.

I think about it all the time because when you look at my car and how I hit the animal, I don’t really think people realize how bad it actually could have been. I drive these freeways all the time and there is wildlife where we live. And it was very scary.

I had a great pregnancy, a wonderful experience. The parents went to most of the appointments with me and we made it to 39 weeks and two days. And another interesting thing before the car accident story was they started prepping me at 36 weeks saying, have you scheduled your 39 week induction? And I said, “No, that’s new to me.” And I went back to the same midwives that I had Sonny with, which was my choice and the parents really didn’t care. They were like, whatever you want to do. And I had a great experience even though it’s 45 minutes from my house. So I went there again but they started saying this and I was like, “No, no one told me that.” And then they kind of said, “Well, it probably should have been discussed before but you are over 35 years old and it’s an IVF baby. And I guess, I don’t know a lot, it’s something that I do want to look into — these little things I learned along the way that I wasn’t told by anyone — like how IVF babies have a slightly increased chance of stillbirth. I don’t know why. And they say it’s also more common in frozen to thawed embryos than fresh. But that is another choice you can do in this journey is if all the stars align then the eggs and embryos can be harvested and never frozen and then implanted. And so I wasn’t really thrilled to hear that because I wanted it to happen on its own and the parents were super supportive. They were like, we didn’t know this either. So we just kept going to these appointments. Everything was always fine. We had some supportive midwives who were like, “If you want to keep waiting, that’s fine. We just have to say these things.” And so I went to see “Hamilton” and I was driving home after a night out with my girlfriend. It was a Sunday and I had an appointment on Monday but I was driving home and a moose hit me. That’s how I like to say it because this moose came out of nowhere. He took out the car in the speeding lane and it happened so fast that I was in the middle lane going 70 miles an hour and she never even braked. There was no time for her to break — this animal at almost midnight ran across the road. So her car got more of the brunt of it but it just flopped into my lane. And I couldn’t even believe I ran over this thousand pound animal and closed my eyes and screamed and somehow never let go of the steering wheel and my airbags went off and I just like had to take a moment to breathe. And then I thought my car was on fire because I’ve never had an airbag go off. And so it was so smoky and I just like got out of the car and it was a wild evening to say the least. I was somehow completely fine and the baby was completely fine, which is incredible because the little guy got the impact of the airbag because my stomach took all of it. Someone stopped and they’re like, are you okay? And I was like, fine, but I’m nine months pregnant and I think we should call an ambulance. So they came and they checked out my vitals but they actually don’t have anything to monitor a baby on an ambulance. So they were like, “You’re fine. Your blood pressure’s a little high but that’s to be expected, you just hit a moose.” So I called the parents to explain to them what happened. They were scared for me but understanding. Her husband last spring had actually totaled their truck by hitting a deer so they understand. But I’ve lived here 18 years and never, I don’t think I’ve even ran over a possum. And I just took out the biggest animal aside from an elk while nine months pregnant. And so I had my regular appointment the next morning and when I went there they were just kind of like, okay, it’s strike three. Like you are over 35, you are having an IVF baby and you hit a moose. Like we support your wishes, but you know, you are carrying this child and you’ve made it so far. And that’s where my mind shifted to, this is someone else’s baby. And I want to give them a healthy baby. And if God forbid there was something, you know, like he was just jolted so much and wasn’t fine. Then it would’ve been not very good if I would’ve waited days and then woken up and had a different outcome. So I just said, let’s schedule it. So two days later I scheduled an induction. So that was something I hadn’t done before. And I was really nervous and grouchy about it because I think babies will come when they want to come. And, I wasn’t really thrilled to see the journey end. And in this way I felt like it might end in a C-section, which there’s nothing wrong with that. I just have a lot of friends and people I’ve talked to who just kind of felt like sometimes when you get induced it doesn’t end the way that you want but every journey is different. So this was just me in my head. And I will say that it was wonderful. I checked into the hospital at 11:00 a.m. They gave me the Pitocin at 1:00 p.m. and I was completely fine until 5:30 p.m. and that’s when the contractions got unbearable and I delivered him at just before 7:00 p.m. So it was super quick.

What was unfortunate was that the parents were not feeling well and because of our situation and allowing extra bodies in the room because it wasn’t my baby, we all had to test for COVID. Unfortunately they were positive and even though it was their baby they were not the patient. And so it became an even crazier ending to this journey. I was super devastated for them that they couldn’t be there but we rallied in less than 24 hours and came up with a plan and my good girlfriends who they’re related to, I invited one of them to come and set up a laptop and FaceTime the birth, which I would’ve normally not done.

Amazing.

** Maybe try to find the line here?

And she took pictures and her wife had ended in a C-section so it was really cool for her to see a vaginal birth. And so the parents were FaceTimed in and then Grandma came also because there needed to be somebody to take this baby so that there was no, you know — of course Nick and I would’ve stepped up to do it, but you know, it probably wasn’t right. But like, this was the craziest turn of events, you know, but everyone felt really strongly like someone else should be there. And so Grandma took the baby after the whole cord thing — they just laid him on my stomach instead of my chest to do the cord pulsing. And then grandma cut the cord. She did skin to skin and then she basically stayed with him in her own room and I had my own room and it was just like the wildest.

Wow. Okay. Because this is the part I think about a lot. And I think, what is that moment like? You know what it’s like to give birth and the feeling is like total relief and then you get your baby, your baby’s on your chest. You might nurse, you might just snuggle, you know, what was that like, like someone takes the baby or maybe you were so prepared for it that you just knew that this moment was happening right away?

Yeah. The whole week leading up to it I was probably the most frazzled just because the moose and COVID and all these things that like I wasn’t prepared for mentally and emotionally but the entire time I never felt a bond, you know, like knowing this is someone else’s baby and I’m helping them and I’m doing this for them and I’m just literally helping a child that was already conceived, grow, you know? And I liked being pregnant. I was a little scared again for the labor because Sonny’s wasn’t easy. It was 22 hours. So this was great — like a less than five hour thing but yeah I felt really determined at the end. Whereas with Sonny I was so exhausted. I was on my own in the middle of the night and got no sleep. And by the time that I pushed on and off for seven hours with him I was just so exhausted. And of course it was still one of the greatest moments of my life, but I was like, “Whew!” And this time it was like, I went in, I knew what I was doing. I was nervous because I had never been induced, but I had a really great midwife and I loved my nurse. I think the people around you can make or break your experience. And yes, this grandma who I had never met, Nick and I were both kinda like, oh, this is going to be interesting. But whe was amazing. Her name is Penny. They call her Penny Poppins and she had seven children of her own unmedicated. She was like a doula for me — she was putting bags on me, massaging me without me asking, like I couldn’t have asked for a better stranger to be there amidst all of these crazy turn of events. When it was getting close and I was getting frustrated — and I don’t think there were that many scary moments but he had a super short chord, and so as I was pushing, they were seeing his heart rate dropping but this was only 17 minutes of pushing. So it all happened so quick. I was like, this baby is coming out. I just ignored everyone’s counting. And I just kept pushing and pushing. And on the third one he was out. And it was like a wave of relief. I wish the parents could have been there in person but I could hear them cheering. And Nick was there and I loved my nurse. It was so cool and rewarding and amazing. I loved it. And if I was 10 years younger and had infinite amounts of money I would have a dozen children and I know not all of them would go that way but for me it was super positive.

That’s amazing. So they laid him on your belly and then Penny Poppins took him.

Yep. Penny Poppins took him and got him cleaned up and all of that. And I went to my room and my girlfriend brought Jimmy John’s because you can’t eat deli meat for nine months. I threw on some trash TV and ate deli sandwiches and cookies and felt like a new woman compared to the first time that I gave birth. Because that time I was so swollen, I had stitches. I had a catheter from pushing for so long. And so I really couldn’t even get up. And this time I was like, I know you do need to rest, but I felt so great. Like when it was time to get up to go pee for the first time I wasn’t scared. Due to it not being my baby and my second birth they released me the next day at 11:00 AM. I was able to walk out of the hospital almost 24 hours after arriving. And Penny stayed with the baby and then needed to go home with the baby. She had a friend come help her because unfortunately the parents were so sick that they were advised to not see him. They got to see him by car at first and then masked up and then around five days they had him. You know, all these things aside, it’s like, they have this child forever now. And so it sucks that some of this other stuff happened, but it’s like, they still got the best gift ever.

What was postpartum like for you?

It was pretty good. I didn’t get depressed. I didn’t get super emotional. I had one emotional day and that was the same with Sonny when my milk came in and you’re like, what is happening? Like that day stay away because, you know, poor Nick, like my hormones weren’t like waves of sadness or anything like that. It was just like, your body is about to start this next crazy thing. So that day was hard but the rest of it was like, it really was fine. And it was a much easier recovery having done it one time before. So I just rested and went back to work and I am still pumping for them now and giving them all of my milk. So I’m not like completely done with this journey yet. It’s just like an agreement between us. They are grateful for whatever I could give but they’re also absolutely fine with formula. And I wasn’t putting time on it. I’m just going to see how it goes and whatever happens, happens. And so I started in the hospital that first day and that was a little bit rough because first of all, you don’t have milk and you’re using this like terrible hospital grade pump but you would get syringes of colostrum, and then my milk came in. I’m going to do the math because you don’t know if you choose to breastfeed how much milk you are producing. I average about 30 ounces a day, seven days a week. So if I’m doing my math right it’s about 6,000 ounces a month. I’m on month three.

I was wondering, what is the connection going to be like for you and this child going forward? And do you see the baby? Have you held the baby or do you just drop your milk off and that’s your connection?

So in the hospital I held him right after — the whole skin to skin and all of that. And I was going to be fine with whatever. I would respect whatever the parents wanted. And prior to them getting sick, they wanted their own room separate and I fully supported that, so after birth and then the next day, we went and visited him and my friend was there and they were all helping Penny. And so I held him again and I’ve seen him a couple of times. With the milk though I just do it on my way to work and just drop it off and respect their space and I’m not sure what the future will be.

Would you do it again?

I would, I would do it 10 out of 10. I loved it so much. I’m sure my family is like, okay, take a break. But I was like, let’s do it again. You know? I probably would like to have another kid so I’ll probably just take the next year, year and a half and fully recover, you know? And then seriously think about if we’re going to grow our own family. However, if we decided to be just content with one, I will be very sad to think that that was my last birth ever. So yes, I would seriously do it again for somebody and maybe it wouldn’t be as incredible. Maybe I would be miserable, you know? But, it was cool. I have a lot of friends who weren’t as fortunate to get pregnant right away, their stories all look so different. Most of them are growing their families or have finally got their wishes granted. It was eye opening to do all of the stuff leading up to it. I would do it again. And anyone who is curious about it I’m always like, yeah, I’ll tell you my journey. Some people are like, I could never, I just could never, and I’m like, well, you may not want to ever, and that’s fully respectable, you know? But like, you could, you know, like you’re giving the best gift ever. And if you go in with the mentality that it’s not your baby and you’re willing to sign your body up for some hard work, it’s pretty cool.

Definitely. Well, like I said, I think it takes a certain personality and I think you’re the perfect person for it. And they are a lucky family. That’s amazing.

Yeah. I was like, with all this science that’s out there, is there a way that I could carry someone else’s baby and my own, like go for twins!

Get it done! I’m sure that it is possible somehow out there! Well, this has been great. I’m so glad that you shared your story. I’ve been in love with it ever since I found out you were doing it. I thought, wow, that’s amazing.

Yes, it was fun! And anyone who has questions, I’m happy to answer them. It was a cool experience for sure. ❤️